May 15, 2009 How do you title a post like this? Trigger warnings.
Trigger warnings
I am a woman, indeed a feminist and I’m sick of fighting with other women and with men as to WHETHER rape is wrong and WHEN rape is wrong and WHY rape is wrong and HOW the way we discuss it is wrong, stupid, demeaning, insufficient and just another way to prop up rape culture.
I’m sick of victim blaming and ‘slut shaming’ and ‘Oh well you were in the ROOM’, or ‘Well you have had SEX before’, ‘ Well you WERE flirting’.
I’m sick of the readiness to assume women to be pathological liars utterly unable to handle their own sexuality, and willing to destroy lives by false rape claims as a kind of sport.
I’m sick of the readiness to assume the total innocence of a man who at BEST had post match extramarital *sex* by tricking a naive girl into agreeing to having sex with him and two others and THEN called another nine or so grown and beefy men in to watch and comment and laugh and grope fondle and snigger while he and apparently FIVE others fucked’ her for his OWN amusement and validation, and quite certainly not hers. That’s NOT group sex, that’s NOT a romp, that’s setting up sexual assault.
And WHY do we so readily believe him? Oh, cos he said he didn’t do it. Ok. Bullies bully and when they’re caught they say they didn’t. So a denial means fuck all frankly. Would *YOU* say ‘Why YES officer, I did indeed break the law and brutalise that girl for shits and giggles, please arrest me and put me in jail immediately’ if you were a big tough well paid well respected footy player who figured they could get away with it? Or would you all already have agreed in advance ‘Deny, deny, deny’.
He said he didn’t, she said he did. WHY are we so very ready to ignore her extremely serious claims absolutely and completely and only discuss it as ‘group sex’ as if it was all just warm and fuzzy and lovely? We’re not talking about him going to a swingers club, where he took part in a consensual orgy with other fully consenting adults all on an equal footing in terms of power and security, we’re talking about a thirty year old football star and eleven other fully grown men and one nineteen year old hotel worker in a room.
Group sex is no issue. If Footy Teams wanna fuck each other in the showers as a post match bonding exercise, go for your fucking lives. If you wanna get into group scenes in clubs, or with other people with similar interests, what the fuck of it? This is NOT what was described here.
The term ‘gang bang’ makes my stomach turn, but it seems far more apt in its nastiness than ‘group sex’ as a descriptor of what happened even IF consent is proved/assumed. It’s all about *the gang*, *the dudes*, the pack mentality, and the *bang* it appears to me is all about the gang bonding over treating the ‘bang-ee’ for lack of a better term as not quite human, the prop for ‘good times’, the object to be passed around, the prop for the gang at the ‘bangs’ expense. The more humiliating for the victim, the more fun for the gang right?
And then denial is so easy. It took me three seconds to figure out how you’d get a girl in that situation not to move ‘Shut your mouth and stay still or I’ll snap your fucking neck’. Girl stays still. Cops say ‘No brusies!’, case goes nowhere. If I had gone to a room for sex with a couple of football players and found myself in a room of twelve burly men participating in an activity I didn’t consent to I don’t think I would move either if one of them was on top of me. I’d will them all to spontaneously combust, for someone to find me and help me, for me to die, for it to end, but I’d be staying still from fear of further brutality and just waiting for it to be over.
TRIGGER TRIGGER TRIGGER WARNINGS:
A friend of mine told me years ago of a story she’d been told by a guy who had been in the armed forces of regular group bonding exercise within the armed forces in a particular area. These guys would go to a bar and single out a ‘not so attractive’ girl. One would chat her up, trick her back to the room (whether under some ‘I just want to talk’ guise, or whether by making her think that THEY were going to have sex, consent to which means NOTHING in the face of what is to come) where the rest were waiting. Then they’d insult her til she cried and take turns ‘riding her’ (ie RAPING HER) the sport being seeing who could ‘stay on’ the longest while she was bucking and thrashing to GET THEM OFF OF HER.
Group rape as manly bonding where the entire POINT for the bonding to be ‘fun, funny and effective’ for the men involved is her total and utter LACK of consent, her explicit rejection of consent and of the situation, her expectation of one scenario, and ending up in another, her humiliation at the jeering laughter, her physical and emotional pain, her desperate fight to end it, her desperate desire for it all to end.
This shit happens, it’s real. And I don’t tell it to sicken, I tell it because it’s telling of an ACTUALLY EXISTING group mentality, of the sort of masculinity that thinks that men need to be ‘hard’ and that ‘hard men’ need to bond, and that hard men bond by meting out the sickest most revoltingly inhumane treatment to women. Cos it’s ‘funny’. Just like chick jokes. Men who seem to have a very confused understanding of consent.
Didn’t know that happened? Me too. If the armed forces, the guys society holds up as ‘good guys’, guys who’ll take one for the team, country bond in this way, if we hear coaches and managers comparing footy players to blokes preparing for war, if we know that some men do this, why is it so hard to fathom that others do – why do we assume they wouldn’t cos they seem like ‘good blokes’ – Disney sold us up the river kids, the baddies aren’t scarred eye-patch wearing villains with hooked noses and black hats – rapists don’t wear an I.D badge.
It’s time we got our heads out of the sand. There is a particularly extreme and vile strain of masculinity out there associated with toughness as synonymous with meanness, with ‘bonding’ as synonymous for ‘let’s go brutalise some women’, with a fucking self preserving secrecy and a deliberate blindness to consent and an utter disregard for the humanity of women. A masculinity that if you scratch the surface positively screams ‘I should have killed her when I had the chance the stupid whore’.
Whether Johns et al were part of this group we’ll probably never know. But even on the most charitable of readings they were as Kate Ellis has phrased it acting in a predatory way to lure a young girl up to a room on the pretext of sex with a couple of guys (so they say) and then having another nine guys come in to jeer and mock and grab and molest.
And then there’s what feels like a majority of the rest of society. Sitting idly by not actually caring what happens to women so long as our heroes get to put their dicks wherever they want, whenever they want, regardless of what it does to others. Masculinity that may not, itself rape, but is happy to continue to reap the benefits of society as it is, happy to go home to female lovers but equally happy to sit with mates and listen to them say revolting things about women. Women happy to damn other women as ‘bad women’ who ‘deserve what they get’ if they agree to sex with more than one guy.
If you listen to people talk about what’s expected from footy players you’d honestly think they were discussing soldiers headed out to war. Somehow in all that we’re meant to think it’s just an understandable by-product of both football and the armed services that in producing men willing to take physical risks and injuries for their sport/for the armed forces that women will JUST.GET.RAPED (DEAL PLEASE). We’re supposed to *understand* that where hard men bond women get broken. Poor hard men. Didn’t REALISE. Didn’t MEAN to.
Then some of the people who want to ‘help’ just can’t help but do more damage:
Pru Goward? Shut your face about a woman agreeing to sex with one or two men being ‘risky behaviour’ and not leading to ‘white weddings’. Pru Goward? Shut your face about how you’re just so ‘sick and tired’ of women not pursuing claims in court and the ‘smells’ this leaves all over the footy players and women who allege rape.
This sort of fucking homogenising sanitising view of what is acceptable sex for a girl to have, of what it leads to is incredibly destructive and offensive, and just as much a part of rape culture as the more easily identifiable strands.
There is nothing wrong with group sex, with kinky sex, with playing out scenarios and roles that are considered by the general populice to be less than savoury. But there are ways of going about it that ensure that it isn’t rape, that it’s not understood as rape by anyone involved, that all involved are happy to be involved.
What turns my stomach is that it seems to me these guys are not intested in group sex at all, but rather a gang bang in the sense that they are looking for some anonymous girl to reduce to a faceless, nameless hole, that the ‘fun’ is in the laughter and mockery, in changing the rules, in ‘what nasty things can we do to her that she would not have expected?’. It disturbs me that we’re so very ready to believe these aggresive team bonding exercises to be consensual and fully enjoyable for a woman who is screaming that she was raped, who’s been claiming the same thing for seven years.
Do I think it’s impossible for a woman to want to participate in that sort of scenario? No. I think all kinds of sexual desires are possible for all sorts of people. Do I think that these particular men would take care of any woman who does agree? No. I think they’ll change the rules the minute the door is closed safe and snug in their heart warming knowledge that as sporting heroes they just have to deny and the police will go away. Do I think the woman is ‘to blame’ if the rules change? No fucking way. Agreeing to sex is not the same as agreeing to the rules being changed without your consent and consent needs to be able to be withdrawn at any time.
- 55 comments
- Posted under Uncategorized
Permalink #
shinynewcoin
said
The whole thing makes me feel sick. Not least of which the whole “hur hur, whoops” attitude of the people involved.
Permalink #
Tricky
said
Do you know women in the US Armed Forces are more likely to be assaulted & raped by THEIR OWN SIDE than the people they are fighting?
One in three female soldiers will experience sexual assault while serving in the military, compared to one in six women in the civilian world.
Some of the women have written in about their experiences here – graphic disturbing content
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/03/17/eveningnews/main4872713.shtml
Permalink #
QoT
said
This is a great post, FP. I wish the bastards out there who keep acting like being paid to play rugby is some kind of Never Does Anything Bad badge would read it and learn something.
Permalink #
bri
said
Totally this.
Thanks you for articulating, once again, what I am thinking and feeling.
Permalink #
Jet
said
I don’t know what to do with my rage and sadness sometimes. You articulate yours so well.
Great post.
I now have a sick feeling about some of my military buddies’ stories they’ve been uncomfortable about telling. Christ.
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
Hey, I’ve kind of run out of steam for replying to comments, I just feel totally drained over the whole thing. And then I feel like an arsehole for saying that…*I’m* drained? Thanks for all the comments and for reading. And thanks Jet for that Made Of Awesome post today:http://iamnotacake.wordpress.com/2009/05/14/stop-it-just-stop-it/
Permalink # Twitted by hellonhairylegs said
[...] This post was Twitted by hellonhairylegs – Real-url.org [...]
Permalink #
rayedish
said
Well expressed FP. Not much to add as you’ve covered so much, particularly about the complicity of the general public – “we’re meant to think it’s just an understandable by-product of both football and the armed services that in producing men willing to take physical risks and injuries for their sport/for the armed forces that women will JUST.GET.RAPED” then the victim is blamed so we don’t have to examine the masculine culture that’s been created.
Permalink #
Jet
said
Apparently I can only post when I’m spitting rage. I’m hoping to broaden out eventually.
Thanks for the link, and disengaging for the sake of your energy every now and again is healthy, I think.
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kurukurushoujo
said
After reading this example you gave I really really hate people. However, I must say, I hate men a little bit more. Yes, I know: women would be capable of the same horrendous atrocities if they were trained to behave a certain way but how is it possible to completely destroy another human being’s life for the sake of your own identity? It’s really hard for me at the moment to believe that this is anything else than a complete and utter and on top of that willful abomination and degeneration of human character. I know that’s not rational but “understanding” (in the sense of finding an explanation) is so hard, it really is.
It almost makes me give up on men as a whole.
Permalink # Femmostroppo Reader - May 16, 2009 — Hoyden About Town said
[...] How do you title a post like this? Trigger warnings. [...]
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fuckpoliteness
said
Oh…I’m sorry kurukurshoujo. That’s not what I meant to leave people with. Though it’s unsurprising, it is a deeply upsetting story. And I’m told there is academic research into the Armed Forces stuff by Michael Flood (hat tip WP). Also it’s strange to find myself apologising for telling the story, when it’s the behaviour of those involved in the story that’s upsetting…I don’t understand it either. And I don’t know what to say about your feeling like almost giving up on men as a whole. I understand that feeling, it’s difficult sometimes after reading and discussing these things not to stomp around my local area glaring at men in rage and defiance. Anyway…I’m sorry – sorry it’s upsetting, sorry it happens, sorry the world is the way it is. All I can do when I get in that frame of mind is think about the positives I can find. I had a ‘heroes journal’ for a while where I’d jot down names of people I thought were defiantly wonderful, like Rebecca Goemhertz the ‘abortion pirate’ who would travel around in this ship with medical staff, pull up in international waters, take a little boat to shore, wander town telling people they could come to the ship if they needed a termination, and moved on afterwards, she was hated and wanted dead in many countries, but she persisted. It doesn’t make it all better, but it does show some hope.
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fuckpoliteness
said
Apologies for leaving a ‘u’ out of your name there!
Permalink #
Kellie
said
I don’t know you but I love you for this post.
Permalink #
SunlessNick
said
I just feel totally drained over the whole thing. And then I feel like an arsehole for saying that…*I’m* drained?
Not a bit of it. To be drained after writing something like that makes you no kind of arsehole whatsoever. Very excellent post.
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fuckpoliteness
said
Thanks Kellie, I’m frequently declaring my love for bloggers I’ve never met, so no oddness over not knowing me.
Thanks SN. Thanks for the praise and reassurance. Now thinking No Kind of Arsehole would make an excellent bandname/book title.
Permalink #
Remember to Vote today WA! and probably trigger warnings « Imho
said
[...] Although, the logical and sensible (or maybe romantically optimistic) says this is not the case. Fuck Politeness also helps to summarise my feelings I find. Her sharing of her friends story is all to familiar. [...]
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Aileen Wuornos
said
Once again you’ve managed to summarise my feelings fairly well for me
Permalink # if she was asking for it, did she ask you twice? « a shiny new coin said
[...] read more intelligent and thoughtful posts at Bolton Gray and Fuck Politeness [...]
Permalink #
deancasino
said
Y r ll fckng dts. Ttl ttr shp. N rp ccrd wth mtthw jhns nd c. Th “vctm’s” wrk cllg md prss rls syng tht th “vctm” cm t wrk bstng bt th gngbng. Wht whr! Sh’s jst lkng t shm thse gys.
ls t th blggr:
“What turns my stomach is that it seems to me these guys are not intested in group sex at all, but rather a gang bang in the sense that they are looking for some anonymous girl to reduce to a faceless, nameless hole, that the ‘fun’ is in the laughter and mockery, in changing the rules, in ‘what nasty things can we do to her that she would not have expected?’.”
Prtty dtld fr smn wh jst “sms” t sns smthng. lmst s thgh y knw ths gys vry vry wll. r y mnd rdr prhps? Jst bcs y njy gd ld fshnd br brnng in th mrnng dsn’t mn ths gys dsrv t b mckd n sch wy.
nd ys, tht sctn s nthng mre thn slndr.
Ws thr trl? N. Wll thr vr b trl? N. Th Nw Zlnd plc rfs t prss chrgs. Why? t’s smpl nd ‘m gng t sy t n n ncrtn wy; sh. skd. fr. t.
Ths r ftbll gys nt hrdcr rpsts r cnvcts, th minut th wrd “N” ws ttrd thr wld hv bn t lst n ndvdl tht wld hve stppd f nt rprtd th ncdnt.
Dn’t b s qck t jdg. Ppl wll ccs y f bng clsd mndd.
[ETA - Go read the comments policy douchehound. You've been disemvowelled. Yes, yes you're entitled to your 'cutting edge opinion'. Just not here if you're going to be a redneck rape apologist prick.
A couple of things. 1/ You tell me not to be so quick to judge and yet *you* assert you know the truth of what happened. 2/ The word you're looking for,fuckface, is DEFAMATION not slander. And fucking bring it. Like Johns doesn't have bigger concerns right now than my two bit blog. 3/ Get your head out of the sand. Go read the criminal law stats on rape, the incidence of reporting, the difficulties in getting police to take it seriously etc and shut your trap until you do 4/ You come back on here with any more of your dick swinging macho rape apologising horseshit and say anything remotely like 'whore/asked for it again and your pathetic scrotum grabbing screeching won't even make it as far as a disemvowelled comment, you'll be spammed. Go join a 'Support Matthew Johns' Facebook group where you can talk this retrograde drivel and have people swoon at your mighty intellect.]
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
And while we’re at it ‘Dean Casino’ how exactly does it come to pass that WE are fucking sheep when YOU are the one regurgitating the same women hating populist media CRAP?
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
Wait…another question for you sparky…you say she deserved it. But you say there was no rape, no assault. So she deserved what exactly. Fucking genius you are.
Permalink #
deancasino
said
You clever little cookie, now you have a huge fucking mess on your page. You get 2 kudos.
You wanna hate on men, go for it. You wanna hate on me? I welcome it with open arms but quote me, be smart about it, calling me names? seriously? Claiming I said she deserved it? Wow, hmm, pretty sure I didn’t write that. What was the line again?
“Was there a trial? No. Will there ever be a trial? No. The New Zealand police refuse to press charges. Why? It’s simple and I’m going to say it in no uncertain way; she. asked. for. it.”
Does the word ‘deserved’ show up in there? I count none. It’s ok, no one will know you’re a liar you, deleted everything I wrote. I stand by what I said and you gave me the satisfaction of knowing I got under your skin. Seriously, thank you, I love myself a little more for it. Furthermore because of your immature action of censorship everything you wrote and will continue to write is totally, utterly, invalid and false.
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
Be smart about it, calling me names? Mmm who threw the first ‘sheep’, first ‘idiot’ around here? (People smarter than you can put the vowels back in and read what you said you know)
She. asked. for. it. Those were YOUR words. Dear me, I do apologise if what you MEANT was she’s a whore and asked for it, but what I read was she deserved it. (You WROTE she’s a whore and you WROTE she asked for it).
I didn’t delete everything you wrote, I left your consonants.
And enjoy it all you want buddy, me disemvowelling you (read the comments policy)means nothing LIKE you got under my skin, it means I think you’re a fucking moron and I’m enjoying calling you out on your misogynist horseshit, but thanks for playing.
EVERYONE PLEASE NOTE: I, Fuckpolitenss misread Dean Casino. He apparently was NOT saying she deserved it when he said she asked for it. I misunderstood. Let the record show he was actually saying she’s a lying whore who asked for it and lied. MUCH BETTER.
Furthermore because of your immature action of censorship everything you wrote and will continue to write is totally, utterly, invalid and false.
Logic fail fuckwit. It means this is my blog – you have the rest of the fucking world to spout your hateful bigotry, this is MY blog, my little space to fight back.
So sorry, you’ll have to go back to loving yourself just that little bit less.
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
Can I get a high five from regulars? You may have noticed we have a troll on this thread. For some reason I find myself arguing with trolls forgetting all the advice that you shouldn’t wrestle a pig in mud…something like you both get shit all over you and the pig likes it? Also the never argue with an idiot as people mightn’t be able to tell the difference adage springs to mind. Anyway. We had us a particularly noxious troll-wank, and I told him I’d spam him and I did. And since I have Teh Study to attend to, I promised myself that where fuckface comes up in a spam, I’ll squint enough to see his name and delete without reading as guess what? I don’t need MORE OF THE SAME BORING ARSED CRAP. Indian take out and the ins and outs of old system title mortgages await.
Permalink #
Emzy
said
Thanks for this post FP.
I do see that, once again, a man comes in a feminist blog to spew his hatred.
Do they honestly think it will make readers like me go “maybe the menz are right?” Aren’t they supposed to be the logical ones? Pfft… riiight. They just make me more radical.
Permalink #
shinynewcoin
said
“So sorry, you’ll have to go back to loving yourself just that little bit less.”
FP: I love your troll smackdown but even more importantly I absolutely love you for this sentence.
Permalink #
orlando
said
FP, I see you are doing a A-grade job of making the would-be silverbacks grunt and posture. I know you were writing for us, not them, but seeing them puff out their chests to compensate for the shrivelling of their genitals is one hell of a bonus. KUTGW, xxx.
Permalink #
empty field
said
You articulate so well, what a lot of people are thinking and feeling right now. I hope the woman (and any woman who has been in a similar prediciment)in question knows that she has supporter’s and that it’s not her fault, and agreeing to have sex with 2 men does not make what happened her fault in anyway shape or form.
My friend was gang raped by members of a baseball team.
I have heard some horror stories from male friends in football teams. This kind of thing happens all the time.
Does anyone remember the movie Black Rock???? A very chilling tale about how ‘nice guys’ do very bad things! But just because your a ‘nice guy’ doesn’t mean you should get off scott free!
Something has got to give!
Permalink #
rayedish
said
*high five*
Permalink #
Stevie
said
Dear deancasino, you come to a feminist blog site that is clearly managed by an intelligent and articulate person and you want to dribble shit based on faulty logic and then cry foul because you were called out on it? That’s the same logic bullies themselves use. I would prefer that you did not make our gender look so fucking stupid! Hive Five goes to you fuckpoliteness!
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
Hey thanks people. Orlando, I’m in my fuzzy robe and I’ve had my head in cases about mortgages and – how awesome is THIS phrase – clogs on equitable redemptions…teehee clogs. Might be time for bed? I had to google KUTGW.
E.F – yeah that’s what I was thinking about after I’d pissed DC right off was his insistence that if she’d said no someone would have stopped or reported it. Where I grew up there were beach parties regularly. My mum wouldn’t let me go – something I am now extremely grateful for. But the boys at the school…boys I saw every day would routinely ‘take turns’ on drunk girls – gang rapes of drunk to the point of unconsciousness teenage girls was a part of every beach party. Not one of those boys had a stamp on his forehead shouting ‘RAPIST’. Not one of them were *by nature* ‘hardcore rapists or convicts’ as DC seems to think you’d need to be to participate in rape. They were regular boys – popular, sporty, athletic, good looking, amusing boys. And they thought girls were there for their use and abuse. They would not have thought about what they were doing as rape. Nor did the school kids – I was shocked to find people talking about what ‘sluts’ two new girls (twins) were. They’d passed out drunk and the boys took turns.
So…why exactly do we think that one of the footy players would DEFINATELY have stopped/called the cops? Like why? Logically why? These were the up and coming sports stars of my high school…so why NOT those guys?
Another thing with DC: he came right in swinging with ‘she agreed to it: WHAT A WHORE’ and therefore utterly without credibility. Well excuse me, by the same logic every guy in that room was a total ‘whore’ and therefore lacking credibility.
So…back at square one. He said/she said. I’ve read my criminal law, I’ve seen my society, I know who I’d believe.
Yeah, I was thinking about the Leigh Leigh case too, and how the main instigator was spoken of by the judge as a ‘gentle giant’.
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
And please read “took turns” as in speech marks. It was a phrase that turned my stomach then and does now. That’s what they called it. Rape is what I call it.
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
Ah Stevie, your comment came through while I was a-ranting. Hi five BACK to you as I always like it when men tell idiot-men to pull their fucking head in.
Permalink #
slave2tehtink
said
Amen, sister. Amen.
Permalink #
Jha
said
FP, that pwning of the troll was beautiful. Kudos.
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
With thanks to ‘Faux Pass’ who is some kind of psychic psychologist. S/he is *worried* for me. That I am unhappy and unstable – apparently I ‘hate so much there is nothing left’. I need to ‘get on with living my life’ in ‘Faux Pass’ Professional Diagnostic Opinion.
Faus Pass? Fuck off mate. This here is not hate, and I’m sorry your tiny little noggin can’t comprehend that an assertively voiced opinion which calls for EMPATHY is read as ‘hate’ – but that’s your sad and pathetic limitation and not mine. You and your toxic readings not welcome here. Thanks for stopping by.
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fuckpoliteness
said
It’s weird how a pissed off blog post on the topic of gender issues by a female is read as ‘hating’ isn’t it? At the VERY same time as the walls for the pro-Matthew Johns boards had to be closed down for their violent misogyny.
Strange how when there’s no space for talking back in mainstream media that me telling someone to pull their head in when they mosey into *my* space to diagnose me, or to tell me I’m a ‘fucking idiot’ and a ‘sheep’ for not seeing the ‘truth’ that ‘Clare’ is a lying whore who asked for it is seen as ‘hate’.
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fuckpoliteness
said
SttT – haven’t spoken in ages! Eeeeeeeee
Jha why thank you. Do you give me 2 kudos as DanCasino did? I did not previously know that kudos was conveniently wrapped in single serve sizing, or that it was necessary to dole it out in measurements like that, but hell, you learn something new every day. All I know is now someone’s given me ’2 kudos’ at a time, I’ll never be happy with just one again!
Permalink #
fuckpoliteness
said
Just for future reference for all those ‘oh so concerned psychic psychoanalysts’ out there, the above is anger at violence directed against women and ignored, and dismissal of misogynist defenders who come on here screaming and ranting and not making any sense and attempting to disrupt.
THIS is what hatred looks like (comments in response to a woman questioning a Matthew Johns support group):
Who gives a fuck u stupid bitch! It was SEVEN FUCKIN YEARS AGO!!! and according to her work mate from back then she enjoyed it. Matthew johns has nothing to apologise for so go get FUCKED YOU FEMINIST FUCK!!!
Report
and
YOU STUPID FUCKING SLUT OF A BITCH!!!
and
Go Jump off a cliff u stupid fucks. end of story.
obviously ur in desparate need of a good fucking up ur arse,
the only “shame” there is , is you wont be getting it!!
piss off u skanky slut!!!
and
ur the uneducated one, as i told you before on the other db, now youve set out to ruin this one too!!
get a fucken life…
and the only reason why his wife would be horrified if it were her daughter is because she would never want her daughter to be such a low budget slut!!!
and
i think they woud agree with you because you are a dumb bitch who has noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo idea what happened + you are a biast feminist bitch and matty johns doesnt care that he lost his job… channel nine only wants MONEY MONEY MONEY just like that ‘clare’ slut and this story gets the ratings this = happy channel nine waht the fuck do you mean take responsibility you retard how is having consentual sex in anyway a crime you are fucked up in the head and you shouls shut up
Reading back through my post and comments in order to have a think about whether or not I perhaps *am* falling into similar behaviours (since I, unlike the rabid Johns supporters quoted like to actually try to be a little self aware and think through other people’s opinions and concerns)the only connection I can make is calling Dan Casino names. Dan Casino who swung in yodelling like a rape apologising Tarzan to not ONLY tell us all we’re wrong, stupid, hatefilled and ignorant, but who called us all sheep and idiots, who called ‘Clare’ a lying whore who asked for it (literally apparently). Now to me there is a massive difference between stuff like calling someone I don’t know a ‘dumb slut’ and telling him/her she ‘needs a good fucking up the arse’ and calling a guy who comes in acting like a rape apologist fuckwit a rape apologist fuckwit.
To be fair to Faux Pass (why I don’t know) perhaps s/he saw last nights description of what happened at my high school beach parties as hate filled. Take some time to think this through people. If what I’m doing is describing society, what HAPPENS in society and I’m offering commentary that I’m unimpressed without offering anyone the ‘fix’ of a good ‘fucking up the arse’…how is that hate? Fury yes, but you know what? My life is wonderful and diverse enough to allow a space for fury and sadness and still be wonderful. So I think I’m okay for offers of Faux Concern.
Permalink #
hmphh
said
fuckpoliteness- you are made of all kinds of awesome. I keep trying to form comments on this stuff, and just can’t get thoughts happening in a coherent way. I just feel so angry and so sad that so many people don’t get it.
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KM
said
Re the above quotes…
I love how it seems various chest-thumpers defending the ‘rights’ of men to pack-rape women often seem to have trouble spelling the word ‘consensual.’ That’s the second time in the last I’ve seen some dude yelling across the net; “Matty Johns says it was CONSENTIAL/CONSENTUAL!!!”
Yeah, I’m making a cheap shot, but seriously, how can you have any credibility discussing the boundaries of what is or isn’t consensual sex when you clearly haven’t dealt with the word enough to FUCKING SPELL IT RIGHT!??!!
Sheesh…
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lauredhel
said
Ah, feminism as anal rape deficiency syndrome. You can’t argue with the sterling logic and insight of that one.
Unfortunately, “corrective rape” is a real and major phenomenon. These people are not harmless.
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softestbullet
said
EVERYONE PLEASE NOTE: I, Fuckpoliteness misread Dean Casino. He apparently was NOT saying she deserved it when he said she asked for it. I misunderstood. Let the record show he was actually saying she’s a lying whore who asked for it and lied. MUCH BETTER.
*high five*
I can’t really deal with how awful this all is. But it made me feel a just a little bit better to see you pwn the trolls. So, thank you.
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Helen
said
FP, you don’t need to squint – if you go to “Options” and “Discusson” in your WP admin you will see two areas where you can enter 1)keywords which will automatically hang a comment in moderation and 2) keywords which will automatically delete the comment. Obvs the second has to be used with great care in case of false positives, but I can’t see that entering “deancasio” and the genius’s IP address in section 2 would block any genuine comments.
*Plonk!*
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Jha
said
Jha why thank you. Do you give me 2 kudos as DanCasino did? I did not previously know that kudos was conveniently wrapped in single serve sizing, or that it was necessary to dole it out in measurements like that, but hell, you learn something new every day. All I know is now someone’s given me ‘2 kudos’ at a time, I’ll never be happy with just one again!
XDDDD I completely glossed over the troll’s post so I didn’t notice that, LOL!
I’ll give you as many kudos (kudo? plurals are hard!) servings as you want! Do you want fries with that too?
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fuckpoliteness
said
Oh thank you, it’s a little early in the morning for fries, but I think I’ll take perhaps 3 kudos this morning, it’s a Monday and I’ve been awake since the dark and early morn.
Hmph, thanks for that
KM, yeah well, cheap shots against idiot arguments are fair enough I figure. DeanCasino turned up at ShinyNewCoins blog baning on again about the ‘bragging allegations’ made by the ex-college of “Clares” – he did that here too. DUDE – if you wanna talk about the ex-colleague as your fundamental point then LEARN HOW TO SPELL IT! SHIIIT
Lauredhel, yeah I know, this is what I mean. I’m calling someone a douchehound and I’m apparently so ‘hate filled’ that there’s ‘nothing left’ and yet the ‘other side’ are responding to rape allegations with offers of brutalising. And no, they’re not harmless.
Thanks SB (sometimes I feel immature but I’m like no, this is MY blog and if you’re gonna come on all Raving Wanker then I’m going to hit back).
Thanks Helen I’ll check that out.
GAARGH SNC, O.K over at yours drives me BATTY with his bland superficial pop-psych crap: HEY, don’t WORRY people! You’re all just a LITTLE hormonal, who the fuck cares? The thing is he’s just so fucking SMUG that he won’t stand a challenge, he’ll just reinterpret any challenge to the instant authority of his manly wisdom as ‘You need a hug’. Fucking try to hug me after that and I’ll swiftly introduce your testicles to my knee.
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Mindy
said
a little late but *high fives*. I love the way you deal with trolls.
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Meg Thornton
said
Coming in late. This is what I would have said back on Saturday had I read this post back then:
“Okay, Deancasino, welcome to the internet. As you may have realised, you’re able to make comments on other people’s blogs disagreeing with what they say. However, there is absolutely nothing anywhere in any of the various documents which define what the internet is and how various protocols work that says they have to publish those comments. There’s certainly nothing which says they have to publish them intact.
Think yerself lucky. FP only disemvowelled you. I’d've disemvowelled you, rebutted each of your points, demanded citations for each of the assertions you made, then critiqued your spelling, grammar and logic, and published a mark out of ten. From what I’ve seen of your second comment, it would have been a low one.”
Thanks, FP, for summarising my position on the whole damn mess a lot better than I could have managed (it’s hard to translate furious screaming into text and still get something readable). For all the armchair psychologists out there who are saying things about hate and rage, I’d make the following proposition: when you have spent your lifetime being effectively told to shut up, keep quiet, don’t complain and don’t say anything to annoy anyone male in your life (from the eldest to the youngest) on pain of an aggressive physical response, then you are entitled to speak up. If you feel a lifetime of repressed rage, sublimated anger, and disguised aggression hidden behind smiles is a sane and healthy response to such a situation, then you need to read all your psych textbooks again.
High five to FP, along with multiple kudos and offers of baked goods.
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fuckpoliteness
said
Thanks Mindy and MegT
Baked goods? (Makes interested Scooby Doo noise)
Yeah TBO and I were discussing this, the OMG CENSORSHIP thing. Yeah. I took his vowels out cos he called everyone with a different opinion to him ‘fucking idiots’ and ‘total and utter sheep’ with no argument, with only dickswinging insults(that’s just the opening line. Walk into my space and piss all over women with a different opinion to you with nothing of any substance to rebut with? Then bet your ARSE I’ll call you names). As to the disemvowelling. YES – I will take out the vowels of EVERY comment that calls ANY woman a ‘whore’, and doubly so where the woman is alleging she was gang raped. Let’s just have a little think shall we. Whore is levelled at women all the time, whore is complicit with disrespect and rape. Whore is a way men just completely obliterate the right of that woman to be taken seriously, treated with respect or have anything she says be believed. Whore is bullshit – why is SHE a whore and the men involved NOT (with all the concomitant lack of respect, refusal to believe etc that that apparently involves). Whore is violence. If you want to rebut my points then I’m sorry but you’ll have to ‘use your words like a big boy’ and have an argument, or else, yes, I will call you names while I confiscate your vowels. It’s my blog and I don’t need to publish anything at all. Happy to publish any and all opposition that actually consists of an argument, but abuse and screeching with no argument? Go fuck yourself.
Douche hound? Fuckwit? Rude definitely. (Psst, read my blog title, when someone comes in screaming at me disrespectfully I DON’T THINK I OWE THEM POLITENESS) But NOT the same as ‘whore’ especially not in this context. And yes, I WILL play the gender card. As Meg points out girls and women are indoctrinated to play nice. Men swear and shout and carry on ALL the time. I think there is something deliciously subversive to a woman with a mouth like a trucker, particularly where she turns that mouth in all its wrath upon self important rape apologising misogynists.
And THEN after screaming at people he doesn’t know that they are fucking idiots and sheep for not REALISING that Clare is a ‘whore’ who literally asked for what she got, poor little douchehound requires me to speak ever so nicely in return or else accuses me of hate (him being so warm fuzzy and loving). Ha. And PLEASE? Hate on? Could you BE any more of a wanking try hard?
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Linda Radfem
said
Re: The hate thing. The problem is not that women are too angry and hate-filled. The problem as I see it is that most of us are not angry or hate-filled enough.
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fuckpoliteness
said
Yeah, for sure. I think the urge to give up every time a man contradicts you is really hard to overcome. Perhaps I go quite hard in my refusal to back down, but you know. Apart from anything else…it’s funny. Cos seriously. If you’re THAT MANLY and my arguments are THAT SHIT then play the ball…but they never do.
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Tricky
said
That argument “go off with one or two blokes and you shouldn’t’ be surprised at the result” is bizarre –what in effect that are saying, is all men are rapists and can’t help themselves with they have the opportunity.
Imagine the pearl clutching and vapours in the MRA groups if a feminist said that!
Seems they have provided the perfect reason why these guys shouldn’t be role models for kids.
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kurukurushoujo
said
Thanks for your kind words. You surely have nothing to apologize for- it’s just difficult to bear stories of so much cruelty although they are definitely eye-opening. In every case, thanks for your passionate post!
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Jaa
said
Oh Pru. She makes me feel ill.
Consent is all that is mentioned, pleasure does not come into it. I totes agree with referring to a gang bang being more relevant here than group sex ever will.
Fury and passion. It ain’t hate troll.